Copyright Issues and Performance FeesTopic: Performance Fee Column Comments: I believe that this column merits a follow-up comment of a personal nature. I think I clearly indicated that the content was the copyright law as I understand it on the issue of performance fees. This does not mean that I fully agree with the law as it now is written - to the contrary I find it in large part both unfair and to som degree beyond enforcement. There are two areas that I would mention. The definition of Public Performance is absolutely ridiculous - to say that a fee should be paid in order for a group of family or friends to sit around the living room and sing or play music is as far out as trying to collect a fee from a group of girl guides and/or scouts singing around a campfire, in my opinion. Groups such as our AMCA non profit choruses should not be penalized by being required to pay a fee to perform for community organizations such as hospitals, nursing and seniors homes, and charitable events where there is no payment for service asked nor expected. I do not believe that the composers of music would expect payment for this kind of use. When there is a entry fee and profit to be made on the performance then I can understand that the originator of the music would expect recompense. I trust that this comment makes my personal position clear. Bill Bates 04/30/01 16:39 Topic: Performance Fee Column Comments: I believe that this column merits a follow-up comment of a personal nature. I think I clearly indicated that the content was the copyright law as I understand it on the issue of performance fees. This does not mean that I fully agree with the law as it now is written - to the contrary I find it in large part both unfair and to som degree beyond enforcement. There are two areas that I would mention. The definition of Public Performance is absolutely ridiculous - to say that a fee should be paid in order for a group of family or friends to sit around the living room and sing or play music is as far out as trying to collect a fee from a group of girl guides and/or scouts singing around a campfire, in my opinion. Groups such as our AMCA non profit choruses should not be penalized by being required to pay a fee to perform for community organizations such as hospitals, nursing and seniors homes, and charitable events where there is no payment for service asked nor expected. I do not believe that the composers of music would expect payment for this kind of use. When there is a entry fee and profit to be made on the performance then I can understand that the originator of the music would expect recompense. I trust that this comment makes my personal position clear. Bill Bates 04/30/01 16:37 Topic: Copyright issue Comments: This B.S. makes me want to quit singing........anyone who has to be paid a performance fee should be boycotted by non-profit groups...........in reality, I think it is a non-issue until these people seeking compensation start litigation against Public Schools and their choral programs. Doug Wolfe <> 04/11/01 10:51 Topic: Copyrighted Music (Part two) Comments: ...actually, the "curse" properly stated is "MAY you live in interesting times!" Attribute my typo to the late hour...sorry. Bruce McCausland 04/11/01 09:23 Topic: Copyrighted Music (Part two) Comments: Bill, Once again, you have come through with an excellent installment answering important questions regarding a sensitive and highly charged topic of copyrights. I can't express how much I look forward to your monthly installments! They are both informative and thought-provoking. I feel we are in an interesting period of time concerning these issues. The decisions made by our lawmakers will have a long-lasting impact on the direction the electronic transmission and reproduction of performances will take for the next few years. My only hope is that these laws stay true to the protection of the intellectual properties of the composers, writers and performers and not cater to the money-hungry recording companies who have no real intellectual contribution to the piece of music. These laws should have no place in lining their already-filled pockets of the record industry. Still, the letter of the law is what we should all do our very best to follow and it is important that we try to understand that law as best we can. There is an ancient Chinese curse whose wisdom to me is obvious which goes: "My you live in interesting times!" ...Well folks, we are at the very apex of those times! My hope is that I can live and grow from the lessons they have to teach. Cheers! Bruce McCausland <bruce> 04/10/01 22:03 Topic: Copyright Music Comments: Thank you for this information! It is very helpful and most informative! I have recently been appointed the music librarian of our chorus, which has been around for over 75 years. It is obvious to me that our chorus has not been following the guidelines presented in your article or any of the links. If I try to make our not-for-profit chorus "legal" by filling out all the forms to get permission to perform the copyrighted works, will that cause the Copyright Infringement Deparment or ASCAP to investigate us further and fine us for not coming forward sooner, especially since we are related to a Fortune 1000 company? Darien 03/13/01 15:20 Topic: Copyrighted Music Comments: Interesting article. Does our choir have permission from the music owners to make recordings? Paul Paul Mitchell 03/05/01 22:39 Topic: Copyright is also a MORAL issue! Comments: As a person that chose to "make my living" in the music field, I feel that there should be some additional things mentioned concerning this copyright issue. There very definitely are "legal" issues that must be dealt with by each musical performer but more importantly, for each individual, there is a "moral" issue (many times we plead ignorance about copyrights but many times we just overlook the copyright issues and just "steal" a musician's work). We seem to easily recognize that the plumber, electrician, carpenter, doctor, lawyer, etc. deserve reasonable (or many times, unreasonable) compensation for services rendered but in the artistic world, especially in music, we just "steal" someone's work and consider that this is OK. Maybe it is because there are so many amateur musicians doing things, maybe it is because musicians need places to grow as in the church or amateur choruses and do offer some services (free), maybe it is because there are technology advances that make recordings of and copying of music so easy that we think it is all OK. This is WRONG!!!!! Why do so many people feel that musicians (and artists in general) should be expected to give away their training and skills. (i.e.,. How much to you really "pay" your chorus director? Do you expect a professional or do you expect something much less indicated by amount of the "stipend" that you offer for his/her leadership?) How many times have you just taken a piece of music to the copy machine and made your own personal copy (probably on a copy machine at work so you even "stole" that copying cost). This type of copyright (legal and moral) infringement runs rampant all around us. Yesssssss.... It is definitely time for each of us to begin asking questions about the way we "steal" from a musician trying to "make a living" and put bread on the table for a family just like any other "hard working" person. A few years back, a chorus I worked with considered making a recording and sell the recording to make money without paying any copyright costs (how many of your choruses have done the same thing?)...... Many choruses charge admission to concerts (using someone's music creations) to "make money" but never even consider "performance fees"..... One does not buy the music when one buys a piece of paper. One only buys the piece of paper. Search your "souls"... and your "practices"... ask questions... find out what is "right"... do what is "right"... we each have LEGAL obligations but even more than that, we each have MORAL obligations to do the right thing. David Thomas <dthomas> 03/05/01 12:48 Topic: Performance Fee Comments: Could you tell me more about the performance fee? Should we be paying this for every public performance? How about our District or International Big Sings? What about performance of the American or Canadian National Anthem? Bob Russell <rarbar> 03/02/01 23:18 Topic: Copyright Comments: Wow! It would appear that I have generated more questions than I answered in my column. Rest assured that I will answer all your queries that I feel capable of responding to, and will refer you to sources for those remaining. Please keep the questions coming. Bill Bates <wbates> 03/02/01 16:52 Topic: Copyright Comments: Is each chorus required to meet requirements and obligations on their own or do we work thru Int'l? Are forms available? Bob Hummell <bhumshum> 03/02/01 08:34 Topic: Performance fee for copyrighted music Comments: Bill, are you saying that choruses are supposed to pay just to *perform* copyrighted music, even if it isn't recorded? I thought purchase of the music implied permission to perform it. Ed Armbruster <bitbender> 03/02/01 01:33 Topic: Copyrighted Music Comments: I'm not clear on what this means to events like our Spring Concerts and Big Sings...or any other performance for that matter. To my knowledge, we have not payed fees for performing music...that is other than purchasing legal copies of sheet music. Are we covered under some AMCA agreements or are we open for potential problems? SEB Steven E. Butz <sbutz> 03/01/01 17:21 Topic: RE: Copyrighted Music Comments: Bill, That was an excellent installment on Copyrighted music and the laws pertaining to it. Future installments should include some information about where the organization stands in regard to organizations such as Napster and other music sharing systems. I would also be interested in knowing how someone can find out if a piece of music is still covered under copyright, or if the copyright has expired. Where is there a difference between the copyright of a recording and of the music. For example, hypothetically, can a song that was recorded by one of our AMCA clubs be uploaded to somewhere such as napster? What are the circumstances if the music copyright has or has not expired? What about all those 78's and wax cylinders i own? Can I "legally" make copies and try to perform those old pieces? What about making electronic copies? Is there a point where a piece of music will be safely out of copyright? So many questions, so little space to address them all! This whole issue is a real "bag-of-worms" that every member of our organization should be concerned with. Bruce McCausland <bruce> 03/01/01 16:35 Topic: Copyright Comments: Bill: Good article! I hope you'll also do one on performance fees. I am under the impression that any time any performing group sings in public it is under a legal obligation to pay a performance fee to ASCAP and BMI if their licensed songs are included in the performance. The fees are based on the number of seats in the room or auditorium and the price of the tickets. But even if no tickets are sold I believe their is a legal obligation to pay a fee. My recollection is that we used to pay around $40-$50 per concert for license fees....it was an item in our budget. Most choral groups just ignore it. I am serving on the board of the Palmetto Mastersingers (but not singing with them)who are not quite as healthy as they used to be but are still doing a series of three concerts per year plus run-outs. Hope all is well with you. Best, Dave Dave Sennema <dsennema> 03/01/01 16:20 Topic: Copyrite Comments: This topic needed to be clarified for all to be aware when the subject of tapes, CDs or videos for resale as a fundraiser is raised. Good info Bill , keep up the good work Bruce Doige 03/01/01 15:53 Close This New Window To Return to Comments Page |